Advice For Interns

Welcome back!

I’ve been grinding away on a lot of writing on credit recruiting, advice for interns, and other career resources for junior peers in finance and have roughly 17,000 words written so far. This will steadily be coming out over the next few months – and we’re kicking it off today starting with advice for interns. My disclaimer for everything I’ll be writing is as follows – one person’s career advice may not be the perfect fit for you and you should combine the opinion of 5-10 people you respect and then determine what is YOUR best path. But alas, I’ve walked the path of being a bulge bracket intern, and have spent a lot of time thinking through the insight I can provide the interns and junior people that follow the account – and here’s what I’ve got.

Tis the season – the interns are ready for their 10 week internships! Let’s dive right into it.

Now to today’s piece:

First – advice for people with interns: Be nice and understanding to your intern.

To be honest, whether we like to admit it or not, this is how most of us came into the industry: A lot of us came into the industry thinking we knew more than we actually did because we read about it in a textbook, got good grades, and saw xyz finance meme. But the reality is a lot of us were vastly unprepared to be a value-added resource during the early stages of our career. One MD said to me once as a college senior “They don’t expect you to know anything. They’re hiring for someone who can learn as they go.” I didn’t realize this as a college senior, but after six months of working this became very obvious to me. Companies are hiring interns for their potential. Their potential comes from 1) having a good work ethic and 2) having a good attitude. As an intern, if you work hard and be pleasant to work with, then you’re going to win 9 times out of 10.

It's hard to remember, but there was a time where none of us had any clue what we were doing. Arguably, this continues on in your career and the humblest investors truly believe this. So look here’s my advice – sure interns be saying the darndest things sometimes – but let’s try to cut them slack, treat them fairly, and remember we were once in their same shoes?

Sure, if a Gen Z intern is out there being a jerk and snobbish, then maybe this isn’t valid, but if they’re hardworking, showing a lot of potential, and are super coachable then it is your job to help them develop into a potential asset at your firm.

Also – this is a relatively more “stressful” year for interns. College kids are always a lot more panicked about the job market than people who already have experience under their belt to begin with - but this economy isn’t lessening their worries. A lot of college kids are seeing the class of 2023 have offers pulled and enter a tougher job market. Now they’re starting to get spooked a bit and may feel a little out of control. Try your best to encourage and develop them – these guys are probably feeling a little like how the 2008-2009 grads felt, to a degree.  

Okay – so here’s my 20 point list of recommendations for interns.

First - last year I started a debate over whether banking interns should take vacations in the middle of their internship….and people actually tried countering it. LMAO! I’m going to try this bit again sometime soon to get the people going and let’s still see people still think that while we’re on the precipice of a recession.

1) Be careful with social media. DO NOT MAKE TIKTOKS. Emphasizing this in all caps. There’s a reason all the Finmemes and FinTwit burners are anonymous and not dancing around on the internet. Most TikToks are very cringeworthy and seem to always find their way to HR once they go viral. People will 100% get fired over what they post to TikTok or Snapchat. Your TikToks are very likely to be spread to large audiences on Instagram or Twitter – which is totally fair game (you posted it, you gotta own what you post). With that said, if you ask nicely I’ll take a TikTok down, but other accounts openly will not. In general, don’t take your phone out and record or take photos of stuff, especially given all the sensitive materials we work with. Don’t post sensitive information from your computer on your IG story captioned “grinding hard” “working on the weekend like usual” or some shit.

2) Don’t take a week long vacation during a ten-week internship. Last year, I made this obvious remark on twitter, got a bunch of ppl in agreement, but also riled up a tonnnn of people on twitter (didn’t seem like the typical finance folk though) but it’s true. I want everyone reading this to succeed – which is why I’m telling this hard truth. Bosses in banking will frown upon you missing 10% of your learning experience to go vacation. You can always vacation before or after your internship (this is what I did lol). Remember as an intern, you are trying out for a sports team – you haven’t made the team yet, but you’re getting the chance to make the big leagues. Would you leave the team in the middle of preseason before the roster is finalized? Of course not. It’s that simple.

3) Dress the part without overdressing: You don’t want to wear a significantly oversized suit but you also shouldn’t be wearing Gucci loafers as an intern. Ideally you want to dress in a pretty standard way that isn’t drawing attention to yourself as someone who seems out of place. I’d lose any dress shirts with shirt pockets and I’m not a fan of oxford collars (this one may be too harsh but just my opinion). I just don’t think oxford collars go well with a tie and/or suit. Make sure your dress shirts aren’t wrinkled af. Obviously no Gordon Gekko dress shirts. In terms of shoes, Gucci loafers are frowned upon as an intern/first year because you haven’t really gone through the ringer, may be perceived as entitled, and hence don’t deserve this status symbol. This is the case for nice watches too. This is the perception from senior people, so ya, just wait until after a sick bonus and snag the more-status like attire after your first 1-3 years.

4) You want to look professional, this may mean having a professional haircut: Look – so if I see a Gen Z analyst with that typical Gen Z haircut (I later learned it’s called a “broccoli cut”) I do not take them seriously. I figured this was kind of mean of me, so I went to Twitter to confirm whether other people think this. In fact, they overwhelmingly agree. Older generations think the broccoli cut looks stupid as hell.

Again, it’s not about “what’s accepted” by your generation, it’s about what’s accepted (without being said obviously) within the workforce. Again, this is me speaking a hard truth. I’d like for HYH readers to be taken seriously – and I’m telling you a large amount of FinTwit just said this haircut below looks silly! Read the tea leaves.

5) Don’t make the same mistake twice: Easier said than done, but the people evaluating you are keeping tabs on whether you’re smart/teachable. They’ve been trained by this philosophy and are judging you by the same standards. If you make the same mistake twice, then they may perceive that you may not have the ability to retain information, learn from experience, etc. Tough, but this is true and happens constantly. I got screamed at once where my VP said “he asked this same question before!!” to a couple of MDs. Tbh the MDs didn’t really care, but wasn’t a great feeling. Try to keep tabs on what you’ve already asked and have been shown.

6) Don’t #REF the model or some important file: When you’re working in an excel model or PowerPoint on your own you should make a copy from the original just in case you totally #REF! the model. Create a copy of “ImportantModel” and name it “ImportantModelYourInitials”. That way if you do something really dumb (who knows, you may change something they don’t like), at least there’s a backup. Tbh you may need to keep doing this throughout the entirety of your career and should engrain this in yourself as a best practice. 

7) Steve Schwarzman (Founder of Blackstone) once said this isn’t school – you need a 100% score. This is the most important lesson here. In college, an A is a mid-90s grade. In a famous YouTube video where Schwarzman greets the first year analyst class at Blackstone, he notes how only a 100 is acceptable and As/Bs are not. He says this was his biggest challenge when he was just starting out. I’d strongly recommend watching this video later when you’re done reading through my list. He spits absolute fire here.

8) WFH will happen later in your career….your internship isn’t the time to be remote: In 2021/2022 I got some pushback on this point, but look now! Finance firms have brought pretty much everyone back to the office and a large chunk of front office professionals are in five days a week. Obviously there’s plenty of people at three days a week and four days a week, but I don’t know anyone in finance with “one or two days or fully remote”. I’ve previously noted that I thought a bunch of people were making a mistake by moving to fully remote too soon in their careers. I thought remote workers would be the first to go in a downturn and that has played out a ton over the past year. A remote worker’s connectivity is lower than the people a manager may see around a water cooler. Obviously, someone outside of finance, someone who’s an absolute stud, or an entrepreneur can leverage remote work ofc. I personally don’t think your 20’s are a great time to be too focused on being remote first, and the focus should be on building a reputation first. Obviously your first job (your internship) is meant as mainly a learning experience and a great opportunity to learn from smart people! Therefore as long as those smart people are in the office, you should be there too. If the firm has a 3-4 day policy then you get to follow that, but if you have a couple notable people in 5 days a week, then I would suck it up and get in the office 5 days a week. Also, this may be a great way to differentiate yourself and get more one-on-one time while the rest of the office is empty. Also – you’re trying out for a team! Make the team!

9) Proofread constantly: The more you re-read the higher the probability of catching errors! I’m terrible at proofreading. My ADHD ass is bouncing around constantly and I always miss stuff – but hopefully you guys can do better than me. Some tips: A) read from beginning to end, B) read backwards (from end to beginning), C) say out loud what you’re proofreading under your breath, D) read on a different format (for ex. If you were proofreading in word, try proofreading again in a PDF format), and E) print out the end product and proofread on paper. You don’t have to do all 5…(I don’t)..but you should find a formula to proofread and over-read effectively.

10) Over-communicate: It’s okay if you say or email “Will do”, “sounds good” , or “On it” constantly – I would confirm receipt to every email your direct co-workers send you so the sender knows you’re attentive and understood their instructions. Over-communicating via responding to emails is the move because it allows the person delegating work to you to understand that they don’t have to hover over you. When someone who isn’t your staffer talks to you too, it might be helpful to bring up in conversation – “I’m working with Kevin on xyz deal” or “I’ve been helping with xyz”- this is a good way to show people that you’re 1) staying busy and 2) contributing and people actually know what you’re up to.

11) Write everything down: When someone is speaking to you there is an expectation that you should be taking notes. Would be brutal if you finish an assignment but forget one piece because you forgot and didn’t have that part written down. Part of writing everything down too is so you can review and refresh on the lessons you’ve learned from your internship. I’d recommend reading through the learnings you have written down once a week. And obviously, post internship you can reflect on what you’ve learned and have off hand in case you need it in another setting. On that note, if there’s anything interesting you wrote down or worked on that you need to reference going forward – make sure you grab it and take it with you before your final day. Not the cleanest advice I’m giving rn – but it’s something a lot of people do and post-internship you may regret forgetting to bring home your firm’s powerpoint shortcut pdf, a primer on covenant lite loans, or a certain sell-side research report. Just speaking facts.

12) Predict demands: This may be more for first-year analysts, but figuring out where you can add value and save people time is how you can justify your salary. For interns, it’s more about 1) learning experience, 2) being a good cultural fit, and 3) being teachable. But if you’re an intern tasked with “analyst like tasks” then I would try to take a step back and think of where you can add value. If someone senior asks you to do a task that seems recurring in nature, that’s a good place to take initiative going forward. Just confirm with them of course, that this is something recurring and something they want you to do, as you don’t want to accidentally mess something up or overstep. If you can get started on a task that you know someone is going to ask you to do anyways, go for it. Show that initiative.

13) Network with everyone, leave no stone unturned: I wouldn’t network with people immediately (you need to find your footing the first week or two) but it’s a mistake to not block off time to talk to every relevant person you can get in front of. Personalize your approaches and personalize your follow-ups, but recognize as an intern you’ll get a lot of flexibility to get in front of people that you may not be able to get in front of in a couple of years. Also make sure you chill with your fellow interns. Don’t be the person who doesn’t converse with the other interns. These are relationships that can become pretty important down the line as you will be able to pick each other’s brains as you navigate your early career. Also make sure you remember people’s names and don’t guess if you don’t know. If someone has a name that’s hard to spell – check their email first to make sure you spelled it right before firing it off. Last summer I got called the wrong name a few times by an intern on a different team. I didn’t bother correcting them, figuring it’s funnier to let them keep making the same mistake, and they looked like an idiot when they got it wrong in front of other people near the end of their internship.

14) Show this is where you want to work after graduation (even if that’s not true): Remember, you’re trying out for a sports team, make sure you show you want to join the big leagues. Look, you may even have to pretend you want to work there after graduation even if that’s a bold faced lie. If there’s murmurs you’re just using this internship as a stepping stone, you will be toast. You’ll have a year to shop for a better gig – just focus on securing the offer! Also – we’re probably about to enter a recession – don’t get cute! Get the job!

15) Don’t get sloppy while drinking: This is very important. This isn’t college anymore. Bosses don’t care about how much you drink or how sick you are (I’ve made this mistake honestly). Keep your cool while drinking with colleagues and keep your cool if there’s an intern after party that follows a general work party. Again, this isn’t college, use your best judgement even when impaired.

16) Focus on what you can control, don’t focus on what you can’t control. This was really good advice I got from a MD. You have to accept some things are out of your control, which is tough for the personality types that know they can force a lot of their own future. If you put a lot of work in and are strategic, you can carve your own path forward, but there will still be external stuff out of your control that you can’t sweat over and will have to power through. Differentiating the two is crucial. But if there is something you can improve on that will impact your outcomes going forward, make sure you address that vs. incorrectly think it’s something you can’t control. Once you know what you can and cannot control you’ll be able to shape the path you want.

17) In hindsight you’ll realize you asked dumb questions/cared about the wrong stuff: You may realize over a few years that you panicked over stuff that didn’t matter. Try not to sweat it. It’s all part of the process. The stuff you read on WSO isn’t the bible. Just remember to be fair and helpful when an intern a few years from now has the same level of naivety and comes to you to learn.

18) Don’t beat yourself up over mistakes: I still vividly recall dumb mistakes I made as an intern/first year analyst. Hell, I still remember the dumb mistakes I made in middle school! It’s easier said than done, but try not to be too hard on yourself. It’s important to learn from mistakes, but make sure you learn to forgive yourself.

19) Don’t beat yourself up if you don’t get the offer: This doesn’t mean you’re a flawed human. You may not have been ready yet, the standards of the firm may be unrealistically high, or (more likely than not) they may not actually have the ability to hire a full-time analyst and just wanted a cheap intern. Also, in 2023/2024 – the market sucks. M&A is grinding to a halt and high interest rates are hurting economic activity. Hell, the bank you intern at may not exist in a year. One job will not define you. If there are mistakes you think you can improve on, then recognize what they are and adapt.

20) It’s just a job. All this aside, remember, it’s just a job, not your life. A job is only a way to drive cash flow to fund your livelihood. That is it. You are young, you are energized, you are fungible – you will figure it out even if the path seems unclear sometimes.

That’s all! Best of luck!

Be sure to check out Fishbowl’s online community here.

Best,

HYH